members to agree.

[rohnn Profile]

hey ppl,

Just had a "hot" chat with "TiredDeath... Hmm too long nick" on map maroko street.
He argued my art was in spawn, I would not agree.

Point is : in spawn HW not allowed. OK. agreed fair & rules. art, bazoka.. etc you name it.

Still... in Maroko street, the court yard right out of after the spawn (bcs allies spawn inside the building.. never outside) is no more spawn. Therewofre, those rules do not apply anymore. Thus this is no SK.

Agreed not fair play (honestly, if my art hit there, was not ment to, and shit mistake).
But fair play != rules. is it ?

We had a chat with Mr_unknown, dunno when, but not long ago (1 - 2 days) about another map (sorry cant remember name) where axis spawn far way, then run, then there is CP with a cross road. Untill this corss road, this is the only way out.. far far away from spawn... No one argues about SK ! Ask Mr_unknown he might remember. Same issue... only way out !!

Thing really is, that often, and more than that, you can have on maroka street, axis shoot bazooka every 2 seconds toward this very same court yard. Ain't that HW ? so this is Sk as well ? Isn't it ?

But is PS rules SK = kill in spawn.(not capt, if capt, no HW) I thought only way out kill = SK, but Mr_unkown assure me it wans't.

so guys... What's the REAL DEAL ?

ty
R.

[Smadje Profile]

Thing really is, that often, and more than that, you can have on maroka street, axis shoot bazooka every 2 seconds toward this very same court yard. Ain't that HW ? so this is Sk as well ? Isn't it ?

In PS servers people are not allowed to kill people with ANY weapon when the spawn is not capturable. In case off marrakech an artillery will have such great impact and spread off where it could hit that I myself would count it spawnkill. The arty will always hit the only exit from allies. An bazooka shot straight in the other corner can be harmless.

Conclusion: artillery called by axis in the courtyard near allies 2nd spawn will be counted as spawnkill.

[GokuSan Profile]

Mr-Unknown lied!
Well the map you talk about is UJE_ValleyEscort and yes, this map is a big problem and should be removed from campaign.
About that arty on Marrakech's Courtyard, I would not arty there as the splash damage hits inside and spawnkills.

[Death Profile]

Well it was me Rohnn was talking about

And yes his arty was aimed directly in the middle of courtyard and therefore i said something of it.
. There was no way allies could leave spawn without being hit by your arty.
In my opinion it is SK when you shoot inside the courtyard, now the far left and far right corners are ok to shoot at with an SMG or throw an nade at because sometimes also mortars or panzers shoot from there.
When axis shoot a panzer, mortar or flamer inside the spawn, or in this case an arty (or airstrike) I consider it as spawnkill and then ill say something of it.

Hope that is clear enough.

Now about the other map, UJE_Valleyescort.
Like goku said the map should be removed because if allies are just a little bit stronger then axis, axis gets dominated in that corner. If you would follow for every map the exact same rules, you would be correct and any shooting in that direction should be counted as SK.
However there is a big difference in my opinion. In That map you have a great big open space where not only axis can camp thereselves to make kills, but also when you shoot 1 panzer in there, the splash damage would only cover like 1/3 or 1/4 of the road, leaving more then enough room for other people to pass by without getting hi. Artillery is another matter but that should then be the only thing watched on that map.

I hope you get my points now
In Marrakech i consider all shooting in spawn as SK, except SMG fire and grenades in the far corners from allied 2nd spawn.
UJE_Valleyescort is therefore a different map and should therefore be handled different but with more or less the same rules.

[__Mr-Unknown__ Profile]

hey ppl,
We had a chat with Mr_unknown, dunno when, but not long ago (1 - 2 days) about another map (sorry cant remember name) where axis spawn far way, then run, then there is CP with a cross road. Untill this corss road, this is the only way out.. far far away from spawn... No one argues about SK ! Ask Mr_unknown he might remember. Same issue... only way out !!

But is PS rules SK = kill in spawn.(not capt, if capt, no HW) I thought only way out kill = SK, but Mr_unkown assure me it wans't.

Well we had a lilttle chit-chat about the map UJE_ValleyEscort as Goku points out on his own way As I already announced to you, officially it can't be sk, because the spawn is miles away ( if we are looking at the area around the commandpost), axis will indeed be dominated if allies are a bit stronger. And i understand why some of you think it's sk, because it's the only way out.

Rulebook says:

Killing the enemy in his own Spawn (the players' starting locations) is NOT allowed and is considered Spawnkilling (SK), this includes; walking into enemy spawn, shooting into enemy spawn from a distance.

Well this quote seems to be enough to say that it isnt SK why allies mostly kill axis around the commandpost and before that by UJE_ValleyEscort. If you shoot into enemy spawn you have to cross the cornor (if no mortar used). And then it's Sk for sure.

But this doesnt say it's a good map. We already had long discussions in the map-suggestion topic of PS#1, by removing it because it's a bad map, when allieds are a bit dominating. That's why I mostly ask the allieds to let the axis come out a little bit when this map is on, which will increase the fair-play. And mostly a big number of the allieds will coorporate with this and I'm thankfull for the players who will do

About Marrakech Streed, I see you're talking about the 2nd spawn of the allieds. Well this place is a lot closer to the spawn then on the previous map. So on this map ur able to hit the allieds inside too, which will cause sk..... And on this map allieds can’t get away of it, while Death already pointed out that there is a huge space @ UJE_ValleyEscort.

So in my opinion. I would consider it as sk on Marrakech street with any weapons, on UJE_ValleyEscort not if you’re not crossing the corner. But I totally agree with all people who are in favour of removing UJE_ValleyEscort of the current campaign. Because it’s ruining the fair-play for both teams… So I would ask Bowdown when he returns of his lovely paradise or Sebbel or some other which has acces to the campaing to change it.

Thank you
__mr-Unknown__

[Death Profile]

So in my opinion. I would consider it as sk on Marrakech street with any weapons, on UJE_ValleyEscort not if you’re not crossing the corner. But I totally agree with all people who are in favour of removing UJE_ValleyEscort of the current campaign. Because it’s ruining the fair-play for both teams… So I would ask Bowdown when he returns of his lovely paradise or Sebbel or some other which has acces to the campaing to change it.

Thank you
__mr-Unknown__

That's probably why the creators made an invisible wall in that corner which pushes you back when you get too close into that corner

[rohnn Profile]

Thanks for your replies guys.

I honestly agree that art in courtyard sucks... Bazooka a well... & MG
(btw, I dont even recall calling art there ! weird... Too much 2 drink may be. )

Still, all HW, so should be handled same way.
and on valley (forgetting that map isn't good), it should as well be handled same way.

I mean by that :
All HW forbidden @ spawn exit is there is only one exit.
This could help solve many problems, and would not leave space to "rule & spirit of rule" e.g. different persons having different "reading" of the same rule.

Really, in moroko Strt bazooka is allowed in courtyard if shot at far right corner... That's a bit of a non-sense. Technically, ok. But we all know the ingame, bazooka wont be aimed accuratley only at that spot, but rather right in the middle, thought the door.